Zarelidchaos (12:55:31 PM): read my post foo! Zarelidchaos (12:55:31 PM): lol Zarelidchaos (12:55:32 PM): on items Zarelidchaos (12:55:39 PM): if Items are on smash aint a fighting game Stealth Yoshi84 (12:55:40 PM): where u post? Zarelidchaos (12:55:49 PM): if you can except that then yeah Zarelidchaos (12:55:55 PM): my one last post on items Zarelidchaos (12:55:56 PM): well Zarelidchaos (12:55:58 PM): my long one Stealth Yoshi84 (12:55:59 PM): one sec phone Zarelidchaos signed off at 1:21:34 PM. Zarelidchaos signed on at 1:26:39 PM. Stealth Yoshi84 (1:38:19 PM): whoa Stealth Yoshi84 (1:38:33 PM): i see what you mean Stealth Yoshi84 (1:38:42 PM): smash ISNT a fighting game with items on Stealth Yoshi84 (1:38:48 PM): its.....a..... Stealth Yoshi84 (1:38:53 PM): dance game Stealth Yoshi84 (1:38:58 PM): er no...racing Stealth Yoshi84 (1:39:15 PM): well kinda platformer too Stealth Yoshi84 (1:39:23 PM): ooh, no an RPG Stealth Yoshi84 (1:39:25 PM): thats right Zarelidchaos (1:39:31 PM): no it's a party game Zarelidchaos (1:39:32 PM): DUH Stealth Yoshi84 (1:39:39 PM): it aint fighting Stealth Yoshi84 (1:39:42 PM): they aint fighting Stealth Yoshi84 (1:39:49 PM): theyre smoking pot Stealth Yoshi84 (1:39:52 PM): and pissing on the streets Stealth Yoshi84 (1:39:55 PM): and shooting cops Zarelidchaos (1:40:00 PM): it's a party game like mario party Stealth Yoshi84 (1:40:06 PM): turn based and all Stealth Yoshi84 (1:40:09 PM): watch out for boo Zarelidchaos (1:40:10 PM): cause nintendo denied it being a fighitng game Stealth Yoshi84 (1:40:12 PM): and bowser is ultimate Zarelidchaos (1:40:18 PM): and thats why it wasn't at Evo Zarelidchaos (1:40:26 PM): nintendo denied it being a fighting game Zarelidchaos (1:40:29 PM): and thats because of items Stealth Yoshi84 (1:40:43 PM): who the hell is EVO that they decide this? ...pompus assholes Zarelidchaos (1:40:52 PM): Evo didn't diecide Stealth Yoshi84 (1:41:00 PM): my name is MIKE and I dont like kingdon hearts because its disney Stealth Yoshi84 (1:41:02 PM): oh no Zarelidchaos (1:41:05 PM): Evos the BIGGEST fighting game champion tournament in the world Stealth Yoshi84 (1:41:06 PM): who the fuck am I lol Zarelidchaos (1:41:28 PM): and Evo was going to have smash in it Zarelidchaos (1:41:34 PM): but nintendo didn't allow it Zarelidchaos (1:41:44 PM): because Evo is for fighting games only Zarelidchaos (1:41:50 PM): and nintendo denied it being a fighting game Zarelidchaos (1:41:50 PM): why Zarelidchaos (1:41:51 PM): because Zarelidchaos (1:41:52 PM): of Zarelidchaos (1:41:53 PM): items Stealth Yoshi84 (1:42:00 PM): well nintendo is dumb lol Zarelidchaos (1:42:03 PM): so with items on makes the game not a fighting game Stealth Yoshi84 (1:42:14 PM): but with it off, its a fighting game? Zarelidchaos (1:42:21 PM): yeah Zarelidchaos (1:42:22 PM): should be Zarelidchaos (1:42:24 PM): why not? Zarelidchaos (1:42:33 PM): Items are to random and change the cousre of matches to much Stealth Yoshi84 (1:43:09 PM): so like....with items on, its still a fighting game until items appear....then the label on the game case changes to party until the item is gone, and then back to fighting...so it depends on how you end the match, whether its in party or fighting mode Stealth Yoshi84 (1:43:12 PM): stupid nintendo Stealth Yoshi84 (1:43:13 PM): lol Stealth Yoshi84 (1:43:45 PM): their logic is soo ass backawards lol Zarelidchaos (1:44:00 PM): well items on isn't as skill ed as items off and shit Zarelidchaos (1:44:05 PM): I mean think about it Stealth Yoshi84 (1:44:06 PM): thats right Stealth Yoshi84 (1:44:09 PM): its MORE skill Zarelidchaos (1:44:11 PM): like let me explain why Zarelidchaos (1:44:16 PM): it's less skilled Zarelidchaos (1:44:23 PM): if you read my post you'd underst5and Zarelidchaos (1:44:24 PM): lol Zarelidchaos (1:44:25 PM): ok Zarelidchaos (1:44:29 PM): why is it less skilled? Stealth Yoshi84 (1:44:33 PM): I read it Zarelidchaos (1:44:39 PM): because character n the game have something called a sweet spot Stealth Yoshi84 (1:44:40 PM): but it has logical flaws Zarelidchaos (1:44:41 PM): now Zarelidchaos (1:44:46 PM): sweet spot is harder to hit with Zarelidchaos (1:44:49 PM): not ITems Zarelidchaos (1:44:54 PM): sweet spot is EVERYWHERE Zarelidchaos (1:44:58 PM): making it easier Zarelidchaos (1:45:01 PM): making it less skilled Zarelidchaos (1:45:02 PM): BAM Stealth Yoshi84 (1:45:10 PM): thats why you can turn off certain ones Stealth Yoshi84 (1:45:15 PM): like homerun bat or start rod Stealth Yoshi84 (1:45:18 PM): star* Stealth Yoshi84 (1:45:24 PM): thank god Stealth Yoshi84 (1:45:27 PM): er...nintendo Zarelidchaos (1:45:36 PM): flower Zarelidchaos (1:45:38 PM): everything Zarelidchaos (1:45:40 PM): ALSO Zarelidchaos (1:45:47 PM): any item Zarelidchaos (1:45:49 PM): when you throw it Zarelidchaos (1:45:52 PM): it's at it's max Zarelidchaos (1:46:00 PM): like it's a sweet spot Zarelidchaos (1:46:03 PM): no matter what Zarelidchaos (1:46:06 PM): close or far Zarelidchaos (1:46:16 PM): Links boomer his sweet spot is onyl if you are close Stealth Yoshi84 (1:46:20 PM): how do you know its not its minimum...you can't compare its normal damage to its sweet spot if it doesnt have a normal spot Stealth Yoshi84 (1:46:22 PM): its all one Zarelidchaos (1:46:24 PM): thats when it does it's maximum damage Stealth Yoshi84 (1:46:27 PM): therefore, all normal damage Stealth Yoshi84 (1:46:28 PM): just that Stealth Yoshi84 (1:46:33 PM): that damage is really good Zarelidchaos (1:46:47 PM): no I mean the knock back is twice as strong as anything else Zarelidchaos (1:46:48 PM): like Zarelidchaos (1:46:48 PM): ok Zarelidchaos (1:46:53 PM): sweet spoting with Links boomer Zarelidchaos (1:47:02 PM): you HAVE to be close Zarelidchaos (1:47:06 PM): with items Zarelidchaos (1:47:08 PM): there is non Zarelidchaos (1:47:11 PM): far ro close Zarelidchaos (1:47:14 PM): it's gonna do HIGHA damage Zarelidchaos (1:47:16 PM): not low Zarelidchaos (1:47:17 PM): not ok Zarelidchaos (1:47:19 PM): HIGH Stealth Yoshi84 (1:47:24 PM): so if its far away, its even easier to dodge Stealth Yoshi84 (1:47:30 PM): and if you cant do it, learn how Stealth Yoshi84 (1:47:38 PM): practice Zarelidchaos (1:47:38 PM): thats stupid Zarelidchaos (1:47:40 PM): I said Stealth Yoshi84 (1:47:40 PM): why? Zarelidchaos (1:47:44 PM): don't use that as an excuse Stealth Yoshi84 (1:47:48 PM): its a fact Stealth Yoshi84 (1:47:50 PM): not an excuse Zarelidchaos (1:47:51 PM): cause it shows you know nothing of this item vs no items Stealth Yoshi84 (1:47:56 PM): wrong Zarelidchaos (1:47:58 PM): it's fact that they are easier to use then now Zarelidchaos (1:47:59 PM): not* Stealth Yoshi84 (1:48:01 PM): i know a lot more than most ppl Stealth Yoshi84 (1:48:09 PM): thats why they dont agree, they don't know, they're confused Stealth Yoshi84 (1:48:12 PM): cause theyre not on my level Stealth Yoshi84 (1:48:21 PM): its difficult , I understand Stealth Yoshi84 (1:48:27 PM): i empathize with you Zarelidchaos (1:48:32 PM): ? Zarelidchaos (1:48:35 PM): like Stealth Yoshi84 (1:48:36 PM): I rest my case... Zarelidchaos (1:48:45 PM): ok your saying learn how to defend against items Zarelidchaos (1:48:48 PM): I mean thats like saying Zarelidchaos (1:48:52 PM): learn how to fight fair Zarelidchaos (1:48:55 PM): I mean in a real fight Zarelidchaos (1:49:07 PM): someone having a baaseball bat and someone with bare fist Zarelidchaos (1:49:17 PM): which one is more fair? you know the baseball bat aint fair Zarelidchaos (1:49:22 PM): one hit to someone is dead Zarelidchaos (1:49:25 PM): same goes with smash Stealth Yoshi84 (1:49:27 PM): all they can do it try to hit Stealth Yoshi84 (1:49:32 PM): and you can dodge or avoid Zarelidchaos (1:49:32 PM): EVEN if you block ti in smash Stealth Yoshi84 (1:49:43 PM): or trick them into throwing it at you Stealth Yoshi84 (1:49:48 PM): then bam they lose it Stealth Yoshi84 (1:49:53 PM): and if they miss oh no Stealth Yoshi84 (1:49:55 PM): owned Stealth Yoshi84 (1:50:00 PM): you can hit them back Stealth Yoshi84 (1:50:14 PM): "owned you and your bat byotch" Stealth Yoshi84 (1:50:18 PM): lol Zarelidchaos (1:51:10 PM): ok Zarelidchaos (1:51:13 PM): dodge or aviod it Zarelidchaos (1:51:17 PM): why not use you own skill Zarelidchaos (1:51:22 PM): instead of depending on items? Stealth Yoshi84 (1:51:27 PM): who's depending? Zarelidchaos (1:51:33 PM): if you have items on your depending Zarelidchaos (1:51:37 PM): otherwise why have them on? Stealth Yoshi84 (1:51:39 PM): no... Zarelidchaos (1:51:40 PM): if your not depending on them Stealth Yoshi84 (1:51:42 PM): theyre an option Stealth Yoshi84 (1:51:48 PM): a change of pace IF YOU DESIRE Stealth Yoshi84 (1:51:54 PM): a lot of the time I choose not to Stealth Yoshi84 (1:51:59 PM): sometimes I'll pick one up Stealth Yoshi84 (1:52:12 PM): usually not as marth, cause I lose my shield grab and smash Stealth Yoshi84 (1:52:14 PM): sucks ass Stealth Yoshi84 (1:52:25 PM): but...if the time is right, grab that sucka Stealth Yoshi84 (1:52:36 PM): its up to the player Stealth Yoshi84 (1:52:44 PM): if they have enough strategy to make the right call Stealth Yoshi84 (1:53:21 PM): to own a skilled player with an item you usually have to catch them off guard Stealth Yoshi84 (1:53:26 PM): like throw them into it Stealth Yoshi84 (1:53:34 PM): if not, theyll likely avoid it Zarelidchaos (1:53:47 PM): ok Zarelidchaos (1:53:48 PM): but Zarelidchaos (1:53:49 PM): hey Zarelidchaos (1:53:52 PM): Items apear randomly Stealth Yoshi84 (1:53:55 PM): yea Zarelidchaos (1:53:57 PM): changing a match Zarelidchaos (1:54:00 PM): bombs blowing uop Zarelidchaos (1:54:07 PM): they are unfair Zarelidchaos (1:54:09 PM): and that proves it Stealth Yoshi84 (1:54:16 PM): thats it? Zarelidchaos (1:54:20 PM): ok Zarelidchaos (1:54:24 PM): also edge guarding Zarelidchaos (1:54:30 PM): you were telling me how you agrreed with that Zarelidchaos (1:54:37 PM): like Marth throws items off the stage Zarelidchaos (1:54:45 PM): you can't defend agaisnt it without dieing Zarelidchaos (1:54:55 PM): and other things in my post Zarelidchaos (1:55:01 PM): that prove they are to random and to unfair Zarelidchaos (1:55:22 PM): plus items change the course of tier Zarelidchaos (1:55:22 PM): s Stealth Yoshi84 (1:55:23 PM): thats his call for picking it up....at the right time...and the opponent is off guard (or cant defend) and he throws it....good call marth, too bad link Zarelidchaos (1:55:29 PM): and tiers are there weather you like it or not Stealth Yoshi84 (1:55:43 PM): same thing if you were to uthrow someone and then throw a bat at them....helpless Zarelidchaos (1:55:44 PM): you said it was broken Stealth Yoshi84 (1:55:47 PM): and theyre not even off the edge Zarelidchaos (1:55:49 PM): the apearence of a random item Zarelidchaos (1:55:55 PM): apearing for Marth to hit the Link Zarelidchaos (1:55:57 PM): =random! Zarelidchaos (1:56:01 PM): random victory Stealth Yoshi84 (1:56:11 PM): marth sent link off the edge Zarelidchaos (1:56:12 PM): you can't grab Stealth Yoshi84 (1:56:14 PM): its his doing Zarelidchaos (1:56:18 PM): up throw with a bat in your habd -_- Zarelidchaos (1:56:29 PM): he sent of him the stage maybe with a item Stealth Yoshi84 (1:56:30 PM): or uptile, excuse me...sry Zarelidchaos (1:56:30 PM): but like Stealth Yoshi84 (1:56:34 PM): tilt* Zarelidchaos (1:56:43 PM): ok like he knocked him off the stage Zarelidchaos (1:56:48 PM): MArth should use in OWN skill Zarelidchaos (1:56:49 PM): to jump off Zarelidchaos (1:56:53 PM): and barely make it back on Zarelidchaos (1:56:57 PM): like skilled people do Zarelidchaos (1:57:00 PM): instead Zarelidchaos (1:57:04 PM): he can stand on the edge Zarelidchaos (1:57:06 PM): and throw item Zarelidchaos (1:57:12 PM): like a unskilled noob Stealth Yoshi84 (1:57:13 PM): you can be skilled, and still use a cheap tactic Stealth Yoshi84 (1:57:21 PM): doesnt mean you suck if you do Zarelidchaos (1:57:23 PM): NOT as skileld though Stealth Yoshi84 (1:57:27 PM): ken could do it Stealth Yoshi84 (1:57:29 PM): to me Zarelidchaos (1:57:31 PM): it don't mean you suck Zarelidchaos (1:57:35 PM): it means your less skileld Zarelidchaos (1:57:42 PM): Ken could but who says he would Stealth Yoshi84 (1:57:43 PM): ken does it to me and he's less skilled? Zarelidchaos (1:57:46 PM): he knows Items are cheap Zarelidchaos (1:57:48 PM): and unskilled Zarelidchaos (1:57:53 PM): he wouldn't Zarelidchaos (1:58:00 PM): I've never seen him use a Item yet Stealth Yoshi84 (1:58:01 PM): thats his decision Zarelidchaos (1:58:04 PM): so I have no idea Stealth Yoshi84 (1:58:18 PM): a desision doesnt make something unfair Zarelidchaos (1:58:27 PM): ok but it if changed the out come of the match it wouldn't mean he's less skilled Stealth Yoshi84 (1:58:29 PM): you choose to live by your honor code....you suffer its consequences Stealth Yoshi84 (1:58:37 PM): i know Stealth Yoshi84 (1:58:42 PM): it doesnt Zarelidchaos (1:58:43 PM): so no Zarelidchaos (1:58:46 PM): it could Zarelidchaos (1:58:47 PM): it does Zarelidchaos (1:58:48 PM): it has Zarelidchaos (1:58:52 PM): it makes items randomly Zarelidchaos (1:58:56 PM): Ken would admit it too Stealth Yoshi84 (1:59:00 PM): if I beat you in a match WITHOUT items, does it mean I'm more skilled? Zarelidchaos (1:59:03 PM): he'd say "I only won cause of items" Zarelidchaos (1:59:06 PM): sure Zarelidchaos (1:59:06 PM): yes Zarelidchaos (1:59:10 PM): it does Stealth Yoshi84 (1:59:13 PM): but im not Zarelidchaos (1:59:18 PM): how would I be wrong Zarelidchaos (1:59:19 PM): d00d Stealth Yoshi84 (1:59:25 PM): and chances are....if we play enough, I can win ONE match Stealth Yoshi84 (1:59:27 PM): out of like 100 Zarelidchaos (1:59:29 PM): that could just be a random match -_- Zarelidchaos (1:59:31 PM): ok 1 match Zarelidchaos (1:59:35 PM): that don't mean your more skilled Stealth Yoshi84 (1:59:35 PM): after that one match could I say i'm better? Zarelidchaos (1:59:39 PM): cause I won the other 99 Stealth Yoshi84 (1:59:44 PM): see you just contradicted yourself Zarelidchaos (1:59:49 PM): how so? Stealth Yoshi84 (2:00:01 PM): Zarelidchaos (1:58:27 PM): ok but it if changed the out come of the match it wouldn't mean he's less skilled Zarelidchaos (2:00:15 PM): yeah thats one match Zarelidchaos (2:00:17 PM): we didn't say Zarelidchaos (2:00:18 PM): 100 Zarelidchaos (2:00:23 PM): you said 100 matches without items Zarelidchaos (2:00:32 PM): I never said anything of what your talking about Stealth Yoshi84 (2:00:45 PM): so one of those matches I kill ken with an item Stealth Yoshi84 (2:00:51 PM): even if we play only one Stealth Yoshi84 (2:00:54 PM): doesnt say shit Zarelidchaos (2:00:55 PM): THATS 1 LIFE Zarelidchaos (2:00:58 PM): not 100 matches Zarelidchaos (2:00:59 PM): -_- Zarelidchaos (2:01:02 PM): totally different Zarelidchaos (2:01:11 PM): and thats not saying you win Zarelidchaos (2:01:16 PM): it just says you got a cheap kill Stealth Yoshi84 (2:01:18 PM): what if it makes me win though Stealth Yoshi84 (2:01:21 PM): cause of that cheap kill Zarelidchaos (2:01:35 PM): you won by an unskilled cheap tactic Stealth Yoshi84 (2:01:37 PM): yea Zarelidchaos (2:01:48 PM): exactly Stealth Yoshi84 (2:01:49 PM): doesnt mean its gonna always happen Zarelidchaos (2:01:58 PM): it's to random though Zarelidchaos (2:02:04 PM): it's to random to deal with it could happen Zarelidchaos (2:02:12 PM): and someone who isn't as skill as someone can win Stealth Yoshi84 (2:02:13 PM): thats why it usually 2 of 3 or 3 of 5 at a tourney Zarelidchaos (2:02:15 PM): because of items Stealth Yoshi84 (2:02:17 PM): to avoid random stuff Zarelidchaos (2:02:19 PM): therefore items are unfair Zarelidchaos (2:02:30 PM): it can happen once or twice Zarelidchaos (2:02:32 PM): its to random Zarelidchaos (2:02:35 PM): it can happen Zarelidchaos (2:02:44 PM): someone can be riped off in a match that they paid 20$ to enter Zarelidchaos (2:02:51 PM): all cause of something so random Zarelidchaos (2:02:52 PM): NO Zarelidchaos (2:02:55 PM): items are banned Stealth Yoshi84 (2:02:57 PM): money is different now Zarelidchaos (2:02:59 PM): items are less fair Zarelidchaos (2:03:03 PM): ok but think about it Stealth Yoshi84 (2:03:05 PM): money matches, I would agree no items Stealth Yoshi84 (2:03:07 PM): just in case Zarelidchaos (2:03:14 PM): you haven't said how items off is unfair or anything Zarelidchaos (2:03:18 PM): think about it Stealth Yoshi84 (2:03:18 PM): but otherwise its not worth the fuss Zarelidchaos (2:03:23 PM): I've been saying why it should be banned Stealth Yoshi84 (2:03:25 PM): its not unfair Zarelidchaos (2:03:29 PM): so Stealth Yoshi84 (2:03:32 PM): items off is very fair Zarelidchaos (2:03:32 PM): whats the problem Stealth Yoshi84 (2:03:35 PM): totally fair Zarelidchaos (2:03:42 PM): items on is fair in what way? Stealth Yoshi84 (2:03:42 PM): im just saying that items ON isnt that bad Stealth Yoshi84 (2:03:47 PM): its doable Zarelidchaos (2:03:52 PM): sure it ISN'T that bad Zarelidchaos (2:03:56 PM): but it is bad Stealth Yoshi84 (2:03:59 PM): turn them off for big money matches Stealth Yoshi84 (2:04:01 PM): and like Stealth Yoshi84 (2:04:04 PM): tourney finals Stealth Yoshi84 (2:04:05 PM): and stuff Zarelidchaos (2:04:06 PM): and items are in fact less skilled and more ranodm then items off Stealth Yoshi84 (2:04:15 PM): if you absolutely have to Stealth Yoshi84 (2:04:25 PM): but otherwise its negligable Stealth Yoshi84 (2:04:42 PM): sure a random kill, once in a while, exploding capsule, star rod off the edge, etc Zarelidchaos (2:04:50 PM): nah your only defense is "you have to learn how to defend against them" Stealth Yoshi84 (2:04:51 PM): 2 out of 3 Zarelidchaos (2:04:54 PM): thats the only thing Zarelidchaos (2:04:56 PM): 2 outa 3 Zarelidchaos (2:05:01 PM): it can happen twice Stealth Yoshi84 (2:05:06 PM): too rare Stealth Yoshi84 (2:05:11 PM): but Zarelidchaos (2:05:12 PM): too risky Stealth Yoshi84 (2:05:20 PM): risky enough for money matches and finals to ban them Zarelidchaos (2:05:21 PM): who cares if it's rare IT CAN HAPPEN Stealth Yoshi84 (2:05:28 PM): i can win the lottery too Zarelidchaos (2:05:39 PM): sure Zarelidchaos (2:05:45 PM): but the lottery is supposed ot be random Zarelidchaos (2:05:52 PM): it's not fair Zarelidchaos (2:05:53 PM): lol Zarelidchaos (2:05:59 PM): it is and isn't Zarelidchaos (2:06:06 PM): but I can prove how its aren't fair Zarelidchaos (2:06:28 PM): your only defense is "you have to learn how to defend against items" Zarelidchaos (2:06:38 PM): if you can coem up with something better then that you have proven nothing Stealth Yoshi84 (2:06:45 PM): hey man, I got lunch coming, I'm gonna go eat Stealth Yoshi84 (2:06:47 PM): ill be back Zarelidchaos (2:06:51 PM): iight man Zarelidchaos (2:06:51 PM): lata Stealth Yoshi84 (2:06:53 PM): l8 Stealth Yoshi84 (2:22:19 PM): jack in the box Stealth Yoshi84 (2:22:21 PM): good shit Zarelidchaos (2:22:40 PM): I haven't gone teir in awhile Stealth Yoshi84 (2:22:52 PM): do they have good food places up where u are? Zarelidchaos (2:23:33 PM): yes Zarelidchaos (2:23:35 PM): in and out Zarelidchaos (2:23:36 PM): XD Stealth Yoshi84 (2:23:47 PM): i dont remember their taste specifically Stealth Yoshi84 (2:23:55 PM): but i've heard its good Stealth Yoshi84 (2:24:04 PM): ive probably had it before Stealth Yoshi84 (2:24:23 PM): but really...."you gotta defend against items" means nothing? Stealth Yoshi84 (2:24:26 PM): at all? Zarelidchaos (2:24:33 PM): it's to old Zarelidchaos (2:24:37 PM): any noob can think of it Zarelidchaos (2:24:38 PM): lol Zarelidchaos (2:24:42 PM): and it says nothing Stealth Yoshi84 (2:24:48 PM): you gotta agree that you're better off knowing how to defend against items tho Zarelidchaos (2:24:59 PM): it's to commonly used by people who know nothing of what they are talking about Zarelidchaos (2:25:03 PM): oh wow Zarelidchaos (2:25:05 PM): block Zarelidchaos (2:25:08 PM): ground dodge Zarelidchaos (2:25:09 PM): air dodge Zarelidchaos (2:25:12 PM): like any move Zarelidchaos (2:25:13 PM): -_- Stealth Yoshi84 (2:25:24 PM): or psyche them into throwing it Stealth Yoshi84 (2:25:28 PM): and then they miss Stealth Yoshi84 (2:25:42 PM): cause like, you drop down on them like ur gonna hit them, but dodge up again Stealth Yoshi84 (2:25:52 PM): i psyche out john and steve all the time Stealth Yoshi84 (2:25:58 PM): works pretty good Zarelidchaos (2:26:07 PM): huh? Zarelidchaos (2:26:12 PM): jump ove them Zarelidchaos (2:26:14 PM): and Z drop it? Zarelidchaos (2:26:23 PM): jump Z catch Zarelidchaos (2:26:23 PM): lol Stealth Yoshi84 (2:26:29 PM): no i mean getting them to throw and miss Zarelidchaos (2:26:37 PM): oh wow Stealth Yoshi84 (2:26:38 PM): then they have no item Zarelidchaos (2:26:46 PM): cause theirs an INSANE lag after throwing an item Zarelidchaos (2:26:47 PM): =/ Stealth Yoshi84 (2:26:55 PM): they have it no more tho Stealth Yoshi84 (2:27:07 PM): then its a fighting game again ;-) Zarelidchaos (2:27:18 PM): according to nintendo Zarelidchaos (2:27:19 PM): lol Zarelidchaos (2:27:20 PM): but I mean Zarelidchaos (2:27:37 PM): if "you need ot learn how to defend against items" is your only defense for this whole debate Zarelidchaos (2:27:42 PM): then you don't know much is all I have to say Stealth Yoshi84 (2:27:55 PM): and how to use them right, not just a noobish random lucky throw Stealth Yoshi84 (2:28:12 PM): a good example is like.... Zarelidchaos (2:28:17 PM): NO Zarelidchaos (2:28:20 PM): random luck happens Zarelidchaos (2:28:22 PM): remeber Zarelidchaos (2:28:25 PM): Bowser vs Mario Zarelidchaos (2:28:32 PM): I flame BOMB APEARS OUTA NOWHERE Zarelidchaos (2:28:35 PM): I lose the match Zarelidchaos (2:28:37 PM): REMEBER Zarelidchaos (2:28:40 PM): perfect example Zarelidchaos (2:28:41 PM): ... Zarelidchaos (2:28:43 PM): RANDOM Stealth Yoshi84 (2:28:47 PM): how often does that happen tho Zarelidchaos (2:28:52 PM): it hapopens enough Zarelidchaos (2:28:53 PM): so what Stealth Yoshi84 (2:28:57 PM): the next 10 matches you would slaughter me Zarelidchaos (2:28:57 PM): who cares how much it happens Zarelidchaos (2:28:59 PM): it happens Zarelidchaos (2:29:04 PM): thats like Zarelidchaos (2:29:12 PM): "you gotta degfend against items": Stealth Yoshi84 (2:29:12 PM): and then it happens again, but its not enough, you still own Zarelidchaos (2:29:18 PM): thats my "noobisdh" defense Stealth Yoshi84 (2:29:31 PM): of course you cant defenc against random shit like that Stealth Yoshi84 (2:29:35 PM): i dont believe in that Stealth Yoshi84 (2:29:42 PM): im not that noobish lol Zarelidchaos (2:29:49 PM): no I know lol Zarelidchaos (2:29:55 PM): just if that your ONLY defense Stealth Yoshi84 (2:29:58 PM): but against a normal star rod vs no item fight Zarelidchaos (2:30:05 PM): I've stated more then just how random they are Zarelidchaos (2:30:13 PM): but I PROVE how they are random Zarelidchaos (2:30:21 PM): other then you ahve to learn how to defend against em Stealth Yoshi84 (2:31:00 PM): so their randomness in appearing is your only beef with items? Zarelidchaos (2:31:17 PM): no Zarelidchaos (2:31:26 PM): it's the random edge guarding Zarelidchaos (2:31:27 PM): the fatc Zarelidchaos (2:31:34 PM): the sweet spot is INSANELY easy to get Zarelidchaos (2:31:38 PM): and how unskilled it takes Zarelidchaos (2:31:43 PM): and how you guys deny it Stealth Yoshi84 (2:31:51 PM): thats still under random appearence though Zarelidchaos (2:31:59 PM): not technically Zarelidchaos (2:32:10 PM): item swinging Zarelidchaos (2:32:21 PM): and it's an automatic FULL DAMAGE Zarelidchaos (2:32:31 PM): not like it takes skill to space Stealth Yoshi84 (2:32:31 PM): theres nothing but full damage tho Zarelidchaos (2:32:33 PM): and sweet spot Zarelidchaos (2:32:45 PM): you don't have to use skill Zarelidchaos (2:32:48 PM): like when sweet spoting Zarelidchaos (2:32:50 PM): you just do it Zarelidchaos (2:32:53 PM): and it's automatic Zarelidchaos (2:32:55 PM): HIGH damage Stealth Yoshi84 (2:33:07 PM): if you can hit them with it Zarelidchaos (2:33:15 PM): ok Zarelidchaos (2:33:17 PM): example! Stealth Yoshi84 (2:33:21 PM): if you got em off guard then good Stealth Yoshi84 (2:33:28 PM): if not theyr e probably gonna defend Stealth Yoshi84 (2:33:29 PM): or avoid Zarelidchaos (2:33:32 PM): I do some cmobo and get them with a Marth forward smash ti's not a tiper Zarelidchaos (2:33:38 PM): I end it with forward smash Zarelidchaos (2:33:44 PM): the guy lives and makes it back on the stage Zarelidchaos (2:33:50 PM): before my forward smash lag ends Stealth Yoshi84 (2:34:06 PM): thats fast Zarelidchaos (2:34:19 PM): and then Zarelidchaos (2:34:23 PM): I do the same comob Zarelidchaos (2:34:25 PM): only with the bat Zarelidchaos (2:34:26 PM): they die Zarelidchaos (2:34:28 PM): wtf! Zarelidchaos (2:34:33 PM): how much skill Zarelidchaos (2:34:36 PM): just cause of a fucking item Stealth Yoshi84 (2:34:37 PM): cause the bat is hella powerful Stealth Yoshi84 (2:34:46 PM): more than a smash Zarelidchaos (2:34:54 PM): ok yeah Zarelidchaos (2:35:01 PM): Item Zarelidchaos (2:35:03 PM): takes less skill Zarelidchaos (2:35:04 PM): AND Zarelidchaos (2:35:07 PM): I mean Zarelidchaos (2:35:09 PM): you did the same stuff Zarelidchaos (2:35:12 PM): but because of the item Zarelidchaos (2:35:13 PM): you win Zarelidchaos (2:35:15 PM): BS Stealth Yoshi84 (2:35:40 PM): and if they got hit by it, either they suck too much to avoid it...OR you got them to where they couldnt avoid it no matter how good they are, and thats your good strategy Zarelidchaos (2:35:56 PM): no listen Zarelidchaos (2:35:57 PM): like Stealth Yoshi84 (2:35:59 PM): you mean the bat appears only for you during the combo? Zarelidchaos (2:35:59 PM): your not listneing Zarelidchaos (2:36:05 PM): I mean Zarelidchaos (2:36:12 PM): I end it with a forward smash Zarelidchaos (2:36:15 PM): Marth forward smash Zarelidchaos (2:36:17 PM): they live Zarelidchaos (2:36:27 PM): but because I had the bat Zarelidchaos (2:36:34 PM): I'm doing a strat where they can't aviod btw Zarelidchaos (2:36:37 PM): so smash they live Zarelidchaos (2:36:43 PM): but because of some item they don't Zarelidchaos (2:36:48 PM): and it determines the whole match Zarelidchaos (2:36:49 PM): no Stealth Yoshi84 (2:36:49 PM): when did you get the bat? before or after the combo began? Zarelidchaos (2:36:52 PM): thats BS Zarelidchaos (2:36:54 PM): LESS SKILL! Zarelidchaos (2:37:03 PM): I'm talking about to seprate combos Zarelidchaos (2:37:08 PM): one with a bat fromt he begining Zarelidchaos (2:37:14 PM): and one with a bat NOT there at all Zarelidchaos (2:37:19 PM): one with items and one with no items Stealth Yoshi84 (2:37:36 PM): and we are assuming that your opponent had no chance to grab that bat before you right? Zarelidchaos (2:37:44 PM): ... Stealth Yoshi84 (2:37:44 PM): like it appeared while he was off the edge? Zarelidchaos (2:37:45 PM): bare with me Zarelidchaos (2:37:50 PM): yes Stealth Yoshi84 (2:37:52 PM): ok Stealth Yoshi84 (2:38:11 PM): and so you do an aerial combo Stealth Yoshi84 (2:38:14 PM): no grabs tho Stealth Yoshi84 (2:38:14 PM): lol Stealth Yoshi84 (2:38:19 PM): cause you got the bat Zarelidchaos (2:38:23 PM): I know Zarelidchaos (2:38:25 PM): air combo Zarelidchaos (2:38:29 PM): end with forweard smash Stealth Yoshi84 (2:38:31 PM): and fsmash with bat at any range and kill Zarelidchaos (2:38:38 PM): bat they live smash they don't Zarelidchaos (2:39:03 PM): err Zarelidchaos (2:39:05 PM): other weay around Zarelidchaos (2:39:05 PM): lol Stealth Yoshi84 (2:39:07 PM): i know lol Zarelidchaos (2:39:23 PM): thats completely proving it takes less skill Stealth Yoshi84 (2:39:36 PM): i know ive seen unavoidable fsmash combos with marth, but is the bat swing fast enough to stillbe unavoidable? Zarelidchaos (2:39:53 PM): ok... Zarelidchaos (2:39:54 PM): Link! Zarelidchaos (2:39:56 PM): jeez Zarelidchaos (2:39:58 PM): no Samus Zarelidchaos (2:40:01 PM): ok SAME thing Stealth Yoshi84 (2:40:02 PM): whoever Zarelidchaos (2:40:05 PM): combo in forward smash Stealth Yoshi84 (2:40:08 PM): the bat is slower than the smash right? Zarelidchaos (2:40:15 PM): Samus swings bat same speed as smash Zarelidchaos (2:40:19 PM): she has fastest bat swing Zarelidchaos (2:40:46 PM): btu some combo like that Stealth Yoshi84 (2:40:51 PM): well you did say the two situations were the same combo right? Zarelidchaos (2:40:52 PM): stop trying to pick it apart Zarelidchaos (2:40:56 PM): and state your opinion lol Stealth Yoshi84 (2:40:56 PM): but with a bat on the fsmash? Zarelidchaos (2:41:00 PM): yes Zarelidchaos (2:41:02 PM): ... Stealth Yoshi84 (2:41:05 PM): same skill then Stealth Yoshi84 (2:41:07 PM): just Stealth Yoshi84 (2:41:09 PM): more damage Zarelidchaos (2:41:12 PM): no Zarelidchaos (2:41:15 PM): not more damage Zarelidchaos (2:41:17 PM): bat does less damage Stealth Yoshi84 (2:41:26 PM): well more distance....a kill Stealth Yoshi84 (2:41:31 PM): but same combo Zarelidchaos (2:41:35 PM): not same skill Zarelidchaos (2:41:36 PM): because Zarelidchaos (2:41:38 PM): one kills Zarelidchaos (2:41:50 PM): one of them OBVIOUSLY shouldn't have happend Zarelidchaos (2:41:59 PM): making it less skilled because of it's "cheapness" Stealth Yoshi84 (2:42:05 PM): thats the consequense that is more, not the skill Zarelidchaos (2:42:10 PM): one took less skill to actually KILL with Stealth Yoshi84 (2:42:30 PM): because you have to keep fighting when they get back from the non-bat smash? Zarelidchaos (2:42:59 PM): one was easier to kill with Zarelidchaos (2:43:02 PM): easier Stealth Yoshi84 (2:43:02 PM): and more effort to get the kill Zarelidchaos (2:43:04 PM): LESS SKILL! Stealth Yoshi84 (2:43:15 PM): without the item = more effort for kill right? Zarelidchaos (2:43:22 PM): huh? Stealth Yoshi84 (2:43:35 PM): thats what you're saying...the time when you had no item they come back Stealth Yoshi84 (2:43:42 PM): so you gotta keep fighting to earn the kill Zarelidchaos (2:43:48 PM): yes Stealth Yoshi84 (2:43:49 PM): with the bat though, its done right there Zarelidchaos (2:43:59 PM): one of themis just less skill Zarelidchaos (2:44:00 PM): other is not Zarelidchaos (2:44:06 PM): how can you prove that I'm werong? Zarelidchaos (2:44:08 PM): wrong* Stealth Yoshi84 (2:44:11 PM): in that situation i cant Stealth Yoshi84 (2:44:16 PM): because its an unavoidable combo Stealth Yoshi84 (2:44:17 PM): with samus Zarelidchaos (2:44:25 PM): making it LESS skill Stealth Yoshi84 (2:44:26 PM): and samus swings fast so i cant get out Zarelidchaos (2:44:36 PM): even thoguh it's a rare thing Stealth Yoshi84 (2:44:38 PM): but like ganon or fox Stealth Yoshi84 (2:44:40 PM): i might get out Zarelidchaos (2:44:44 PM): that PROVES it's not as skill Zarelidchaos (2:44:50 PM): Items=less skill Zarelidchaos (2:44:54 PM): thats one situation Zarelidchaos (2:44:57 PM): and 1 is all it takes Stealth Yoshi84 (2:44:59 PM): in that scenario, yes Stealth Yoshi84 (2:45:04 PM): 1 is all it takes? what? Zarelidchaos (2:45:05 PM): to prove items are less skill Stealth Yoshi84 (2:45:08 PM): thats cheap Zarelidchaos (2:45:11 PM): items are less skill Stealth Yoshi84 (2:45:16 PM): it proves it for that scenario Zarelidchaos (2:45:25 PM): nah Zarelidchaos (2:45:29 PM): theres others Stealth Yoshi84 (2:45:31 PM): if it was fox, i could tech and escape Stealth Yoshi84 (2:45:46 PM): or whoever Zarelidchaos (2:45:51 PM): ok tech and escape up tilt up tilt BAT! Stealth Yoshi84 (2:45:52 PM): swings slower than samus Stealth Yoshi84 (2:45:57 PM): that Stealth Yoshi84 (2:45:59 PM): is Stealth Yoshi84 (2:46:02 PM): actually your skill Stealth Yoshi84 (2:46:04 PM): strategy Zarelidchaos (2:46:11 PM): it's an EASY kill Stealth Yoshi84 (2:46:11 PM): for thinking to launch me Zarelidchaos (2:46:12 PM): ok Zarelidchaos (2:46:14 PM): easy Stealth Yoshi84 (2:46:14 PM): and then throw Zarelidchaos (2:46:15 PM): easy Zarelidchaos (2:46:17 PM): less ksill Zarelidchaos (2:46:34 PM): theres others Zarelidchaos (2:46:38 PM): but that just shows 2 reason Zarelidchaos (2:46:44 PM): on how Items are less skill Zarelidchaos (2:46:53 PM): can you prove that items off are less skill? Stealth Yoshi84 (2:47:08 PM): you dont have to have skill using items if theyre off obviously Stealth Yoshi84 (2:47:21 PM): so it doesnt tap into item skills Stealth Yoshi84 (2:47:26 PM): attack or defense Stealth Yoshi84 (2:47:42 PM): more technical skills and you have to earn your kills more often Zarelidchaos (2:48:10 PM): you earn Zarelidchaos (2:48:13 PM): meaning it's harder Zarelidchaos (2:48:17 PM): meaning it's MORE SKILL Zarelidchaos (2:48:22 PM): it is a fact Zarelidchaos (2:48:28 PM): Items off=more skill" Stealth Yoshi84 (2:48:42 PM): what about item strategy though Zarelidchaos (2:48:44 PM): Items off=less randomness Stealth Yoshi84 (2:48:48 PM): there is strategy involved Stealth Yoshi84 (2:49:07 PM): just throwing shit might not get you as much as having a good plan Zarelidchaos (2:49:20 PM): see THAT might be able to prove something Stealth Yoshi84 (2:49:29 PM): its like working out Stealth Yoshi84 (2:49:46 PM): items off = there's some muscles you dont use, but you use the more important ones more Stealth Yoshi84 (2:49:50 PM): still some muscles unused Stealth Yoshi84 (2:50:03 PM): items on = work out all muscles and more well rounded overall Zarelidchaos (2:50:27 PM): something like that can actually prove something Zarelidchaos (2:50:30 PM): but thats just 1 fact Zarelidchaos (2:50:34 PM): when I state 2 Stealth Yoshi84 (2:50:44 PM): quality not quantity Zarelidchaos (2:51:00 PM): your thing still goes under the lines of you have to know how to use items and defend agaisnt em Stealth Yoshi84 (2:51:28 PM): it basically all comes down on how you like to play the game Stealth Yoshi84 (2:51:43 PM): items off is like buying a mario party game and never playing one of the modes Stealth Yoshi84 (2:51:49 PM): i just decide to get the most out of the game Zarelidchaos (2:51:52 PM): nah which one is more fair=items off=more fair Stealth Yoshi84 (2:51:57 PM): items do make for some very interesting matches Zarelidchaos (2:52:24 PM): the onyl thing why items should be on is because "items on=funny Zarelidchaos (2:52:25 PM): " Stealth Yoshi84 (2:52:38 PM): it makes the gameplay deeper Stealth Yoshi84 (2:52:49 PM): more than just your standard attacks and dodges, etc Stealth Yoshi84 (2:52:56 PM): items are in now you gotta change it up Stealth Yoshi84 (2:52:59 PM): to survive Stealth Yoshi84 (2:53:05 PM): sometimes you get screwed Stealth Yoshi84 (2:53:11 PM): sometimes you do the screwing Stealth Yoshi84 (2:53:17 PM): and it is randon Stealth Yoshi84 (2:53:24 PM): but it can be random to either person Stealth Yoshi84 (2:53:44 PM): items are not always out to get the better skilled guy Stealth Yoshi84 (2:54:00 PM): and capsules will blow up Stealth Yoshi84 (2:54:04 PM): in mid smash Stealth Yoshi84 (2:54:14 PM): and you can redo the match if you want Stealth Yoshi84 (2:54:24 PM): and maybe....the victim will win anyway Stealth Yoshi84 (2:54:40 PM): that always is a good crowd-pleaser Stealth Yoshi84 (2:54:44 PM): comeback Stealth Yoshi84 (2:55:12 PM): and sometimes you'll get comboed into a bat throw or an edge guard...or you can turn some of those items off if they're too strong for your tastes... Stealth Yoshi84 (2:55:29 PM): and sometimes you'll do it back to them in revenge lol...or you can turn some of those items off if they're too strong for your tastes... Stealth Yoshi84 (2:55:55 PM): items aren't ALWAYS fair Stealth Yoshi84 (2:56:01 PM): such is life Stealth Yoshi84 (2:56:28 PM): we can choose to control the environment by creating a perfect world where life is fair Stealth Yoshi84 (2:56:39 PM): and a lot of ppl play smash like that Stealth Yoshi84 (2:56:44 PM): they make their utopia...everything is fair, everyone earns their kills, no random cheap advantages, no little kids grow up spoiled with rich parents who give them everything they desire earned by no merit of their own....nobody is unfairly born into poverty or third world countries...nobody gets overlooked by the girl of their dreams because some other guy has an unfair natural advantage in looks...nobody gets killed by a random drunk driver on the freeway and leaves their family in sadness and agony forever.... Stealth Yoshi84 (2:56:58 PM): I dont mind playing with items off at all Stealth Yoshi84 (2:57:09 PM): you should see our videos from feb 5th Stealth Yoshi84 (2:57:12 PM): no items Stealth Yoshi84 (2:57:17 PM): I didnt miss them one bit Stealth Yoshi84 (2:57:20 PM): it was still fun Stealth Yoshi84 (2:57:51 PM): but the thing is I can play in either environment, because I'm seasoned with against items Stealth Yoshi84 (2:58:13 PM): whereas someone who never plays with items will fight tooth and nail to get them turned off Stealth Yoshi84 (2:58:20 PM): and stay in his comfort zone Stealth Yoshi84 (2:58:24 PM): because he isn't compatible Stealth Yoshi84 (2:59:16 PM): and to some people they say "who gives a fuck?" Stealth Yoshi84 (2:59:33 PM): they dont care about their performance in an item environment because they never will play in one Stealth Yoshi84 (2:59:39 PM): and thats their choice Stealth Yoshi84 (3:00:42 PM): I guess its all up to who you are inside Stealth Yoshi84 (3:00:49 PM): you're not wrong for playing with items off Stealth Yoshi84 (3:00:56 PM): im not wrong for playing with them on Stealth Yoshi84 (3:00:59 PM): its a choice Stealth Yoshi84 (3:01:24 PM): like our choices in fashion, food, television, and sexual preference even Stealth Yoshi84 (3:02:42 PM): if it comes down to it, I think our crew would still be happy being the 'scrub, checp, n00b, outcasts' who nobody respects....if thats how it has to be Stealth Yoshi84 (3:04:22 PM): Gods of Melee? oh you mean those scrubby item players right? Stealth Yoshi84 (3:04:30 PM): fuck them Zarelidchaos (3:34:26 PM): lol Zarelidchaos (3:34:27 PM): back Zarelidchaos (3:34:32 PM): ok man Zarelidchaos (3:34:38 PM): Items aren't fair though Zarelidchaos (3:34:42 PM): they make it to random Zarelidchaos (3:34:46 PM): they over power some characters Zarelidchaos (3:34:57 PM): items diecide the out come of matches Zarelidchaos (3:34:59 PM): not the player Zarelidchaos (3:34:59 PM): =/ Zarelidchaos (3:35:44 PM): it's ebcause of items why the person would o some random combo that instant kills Stealth Yoshi84 (3:36:35 PM): items decide the outcome, not the player? what if the item-user sucked with items, and the victim was really good at dealing with item users and he escapes unscathed? Stealth Yoshi84 (3:36:42 PM): thats the player's skill that saved his ass Zarelidchaos (3:36:51 PM): thats dumb Zarelidchaos (3:36:52 PM): what if? Stealth Yoshi84 (3:36:53 PM): why? Stealth Yoshi84 (3:37:03 PM): it happens Zarelidchaos (3:37:07 PM): it's suppsoed ot be equal vs equal Stealth Yoshi84 (3:37:09 PM): ok Stealth Yoshi84 (3:37:13 PM): me vs steven Stealth Yoshi84 (3:37:18 PM): we're close enough Stealth Yoshi84 (3:37:26 PM): he's good with items sorta Stealth Yoshi84 (3:37:41 PM): and I've outfoxed him holding a star rod or other stuff many times Zarelidchaos (3:37:51 PM): it no matter what Zarelidchaos (3:37:53 PM): OVER powers you Zarelidchaos (3:37:57 PM): makes you do what you can't Zarelidchaos (3:38:01 PM): nop matter what Zarelidchaos (3:38:04 PM): YOU CAN'T AVIOD IT Stealth Yoshi84 (3:38:07 PM): he ended up throwing it and missing or swing and miss or I just hit him before he can do shit Zarelidchaos (3:38:12 PM): Items diecide the out come if they are on Zarelidchaos (3:38:20 PM): like Foxs up tilt up titl bat Zarelidchaos (3:38:23 PM): thats the item Zarelidchaos (3:38:25 PM): that killed Zarelidchaos (3:38:26 PM): not the player Zarelidchaos (3:38:30 PM): I do it into up smash aloy Zarelidchaos (3:38:32 PM): it doens't kill Zarelidchaos (3:38:39 PM): because I don't got items Stealth Yoshi84 (3:38:44 PM): ok so if ken beats my 10 year old sister, he has to claim items are the ONLY reason he won right? Stealth Yoshi84 (3:39:00 PM): if he used an item for kills Zarelidchaos (3:39:05 PM): that depends Zarelidchaos (3:39:08 PM): on if he uses them or not Zarelidchaos (3:39:13 PM): OR Zarelidchaos (3:39:18 PM): if they came out and hit your sister Zarelidchaos (3:39:22 PM): they diecide Zarelidchaos (3:39:25 PM): sure if you turn them off Zarelidchaos (3:39:29 PM): then theres NO EXCUSES Zarelidchaos (3:39:31 PM): but with them on Zarelidchaos (3:39:33 PM): there are excuses Zarelidchaos (3:39:42 PM): Ken beats me cause a box randomly explodes Zarelidchaos (3:39:46 PM): it's true Zarelidchaos (3:40:01 PM): me and him never fight with items on so we don't know if he just gets lucky or not Zarelidchaos (3:40:35 PM): thats just an example btw Stealth Yoshi84 (3:41:07 PM): let's say that items are on....ken vs someone who barely knows how to jump and smash lol, and lets say a bunch of exploding items appear and blow up on him, also the noob gets all the good items too like star rod and bat, and even a heart for god's sake. All that wouldnt even be enough to help him beat ken Stealth Yoshi84 (3:41:15 PM): why? because ken IS MORE SKILLED Stealth Yoshi84 (3:41:18 PM): items do not matter there Stealth Yoshi84 (3:41:32 PM): no situation will even be that extreme either Stealth Yoshi84 (3:41:37 PM): so even vs even Stealth Yoshi84 (3:41:47 PM): it all depends on skill Stealth Yoshi84 (3:42:03 PM): using and defending against items (however you decide to pull it off) is skill also Stealth Yoshi84 (3:42:09 PM): not just your characters moves Zarelidchaos (3:42:19 PM): items determine a match Zarelidchaos (3:42:20 PM): random Zarelidchaos (3:42:22 PM): off edge Zarelidchaos (3:42:25 PM): you CAN'T say tehy dont Zarelidchaos (3:42:29 PM): once someone is off the stage Zarelidchaos (3:42:34 PM): and they throw an item at you Zarelidchaos (3:42:36 PM): edge guarding you Zarelidchaos (3:42:43 PM): that determines the match Zarelidchaos (3:42:47 PM): it's not SKILL Zarelidchaos (3:42:56 PM): I mean Stealth Yoshi84 (3:43:00 PM): not if the player comes back from that cheap kill and kicks ass Stealth Yoshi84 (3:43:04 PM): comeback Zarelidchaos (3:43:07 PM): I've proven how items are unfair Zarelidchaos (3:43:14 PM): thats something else Zarelidchaos (3:43:15 PM): =/ Zarelidchaos (3:43:22 PM): and thats if he makes it back -_- Stealth Yoshi84 (3:43:24 PM): you say they determine a match Stealth Yoshi84 (3:43:28 PM): thats where you fail to prove Stealth Yoshi84 (3:43:40 PM): no, lets say he died Stealth Yoshi84 (3:43:44 PM): and he respawns Stealth Yoshi84 (3:43:47 PM): next life Stealth Yoshi84 (3:43:50 PM): kicks ass Stealth Yoshi84 (3:43:53 PM): whoop comeback Zarelidchaos (3:43:56 PM): thats something else Zarelidchaos (3:43:57 PM): ... Stealth Yoshi84 (3:43:58 PM): didnt determine the match Zarelidchaos (3:44:01 PM): TOTALLY different Stealth Yoshi84 (3:44:04 PM): how so? Zarelidchaos (3:44:08 PM): thats saying if he comes back Stealth Yoshi84 (3:44:09 PM): it didnt determine the match Stealth Yoshi84 (3:44:11 PM): am I wrong? Zarelidchaos (3:44:16 PM): your saying something totally off Zarelidchaos (3:44:19 PM): like Zarelidchaos (3:44:23 PM): "what if no items apear" Zarelidchaos (3:44:30 PM): "what if no bombs apear the whole match" Zarelidchaos (3:44:34 PM): it's stupid Stealth Yoshi84 (3:44:36 PM): even so Stealth Yoshi84 (3:44:39 PM): let bombs appear Zarelidchaos (3:44:40 PM): "what if I'm fighting Ken and he loses" Zarelidchaos (3:44:46 PM): that makes no sense Stealth Yoshi84 (3:44:50 PM): what if the other guy is just good enough to win anyway? Zarelidchaos (3:44:59 PM): thats a DUH Stealth Yoshi84 (3:44:59 PM): items didnt determine the match Zarelidchaos (3:45:19 PM): they could Stealth Yoshi84 (3:45:33 PM): but its not 100% like you're saying Zarelidchaos (3:45:34 PM): and they will Stealth Yoshi84 (3:45:47 PM): you're saying that all the time if they're on they determine thetwinner Stealth Yoshi84 (3:46:00 PM): and im guessing thats whoever grabs the most items? Stealth Yoshi84 (3:46:02 PM): heh Stealth Yoshi84 (3:46:12 PM): they could yes Stealth Yoshi84 (3:46:15 PM): COULD Stealth Yoshi84 (3:46:20 PM): not 100% Stealth Yoshi84 (3:46:22 PM): not even 50% Stealth Yoshi84 (3:46:32 PM): 20% is generous as hell even Stealth Yoshi84 (3:46:39 PM): maybe 15% or 10% Stealth Yoshi84 (3:46:41 PM): at the most Stealth Yoshi84 (3:46:56 PM): depending on what items you have on Stealth Yoshi84 (3:46:59 PM): and how high Stealth Yoshi84 (3:47:26 PM): items are an accessory, not a giant unavoidable chunk of imminent defeat being hurled in your general direction Stealth Yoshi84 (3:47:47 PM): and even that threat can be mitigated by turning certain ones off and keepingon very low Stealth Yoshi84 (3:48:06 PM): items are ANYTHING but match deciding factors Stealth Yoshi84 (3:48:13 PM): if they were I WOULD SLAUGHTER JOHN Stealth Yoshi84 (3:48:26 PM): I WOULD STAIN FD WITH HIS SHEIKS ENTRAILS Stealth Yoshi84 (3:48:38 PM): because I believe I am the superior item tactician Stealth Yoshi84 (3:48:43 PM): but it doesnt work that way Stealth Yoshi84 (3:48:53 PM): my W/L column against john is embarrasing Stealth Yoshi84 (3:49:00 PM): probably under 1/30 now Stealth Yoshi84 (3:49:42 PM): I wish you were right sometimes lol Stealth Yoshi84 (3:49:57 PM): with that saying Stealth Yoshi84 (3:50:04 PM): 'items decide the outcome' Stealth Yoshi84 (3:50:25 PM): in fact I've come closer than ever to beating john when we played without items! Stealth Yoshi84 (3:50:26 PM): wtf